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| Linings Kerfed or Solid? http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=3935 |
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| Author: | Graham Steward [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 3:55 am ] |
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When I built my first guitar using Cumpiano's book I used kerfed linings for the sound board and solid bass wood linings for the back. This is an option that Cumpiano gives in his book. What I am wondering is would there be any problem using a solid lining on both the top and the bottom? Thanks |
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| Author: | Michael Dale Payne [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 4:35 am ] |
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most classical builders use solid for tops and bottoms. |
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| Author: | Graham Steward [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 4:36 am ] |
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Great I was hoping to hear something like that. Thanks |
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| Author: | csullivan [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 4:52 am ] |
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The solid linings look neat and clean and work just fine for classical guitars, but if you build steel string guitars, it's likely you'll need linings slightly thicker. Thicker linings don't bend very well. They tend to wrinkle or fracture at the waist. That's why kerfed linings are usually used on ss guitars. Both work equally well structurally. On classical guitars I usually use solid linings for the back, but I use individual little glue blocks around the perimeter of the top. I get a nice fit around all the brace ends and side brackets that way. Craig |
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| Author: | LanceK [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 5:05 am ] |
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I have never built a Classical guitar, but to my eye, they look to be flatter or less radiused than a SS. I suspect as Craig has said a solid lining would be hard to bend and follow the radius of a SS. |
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| Author: | Mario [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 5:23 am ] |
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I've used solid linings, up to 1/4" thick, even on OM guitars. Don't need to be much thicker than that, right? I usually aim for around .200"... They can be bent, just need patience, and expect to break a handful. I capped a 3' length of 2", BLACK ABS pipe at one end, and fixed a removable cap at the other end. Fill with water, insert as many lengths of linings as you can fit loosely(around 7-8 in mine), cap it tight(but leave room for the water to expand) and set it out in the sun for a few hours. The water will come to a near boil! Even in winter, a sunny window will get it pretty warm. Get your bender good and hot, as you would if you were bending sides, then pull the linings out, and bend them, 4 at a time if you can. I've bent everything from spruce to oak to walnut to white birch. The only one I could never get to bend, eventually, was western red cedar. Kerfed linings evolved on steel string guitars because these guitars evolved in factories, so we accept it as correct, but there's nothing wrong with solid linings, and much to be said for how clean they look, and how much stiffness they add to the entire structure. |
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| Author: | Jim Watts [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 5:57 am ] |
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I use solid linings on all my instruments, spanish cedar About 3/16 thick. I just like how clean it looks and think that in the end it's easier to work with. |
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| Author: | sfbrown [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 7:36 am ] |
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For what it is worth, my GV Rubio has kerfed linings. Triangular on the top and reverse on the back. I have to say though that I had to look closely to see that the back linings were indeed kerfed. Looks good and it is on concert instrument so I guess it's different strokes for different folks. Regards, Steve |
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| Author: | rlabbe [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 8:01 am ] |
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[QUOTE=MichaelP] most classical builders use solid for tops and bottoms.[/QUOTE]I don't think so. The spanish method of construction traditionally uses tetellones (sp?) to join the top to the sides. These are individual blocks usually spaced several mm apart, 4mm or so. There are makers who use solid linings for the top, such as Miguel Rodriguez, but it complicates the build process for spanish heel construction. Solid linings are indeed very often used for the back. Not that I think it the above matters for steel string construction. |
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| Author: | CarltonM [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 8:41 am ] |
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You could also bend thiner solid linings and laminate them on the instrument to whatever thickness you desire. |
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| Author: | John Kinnaird [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 11:18 am ] |
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I wonder if kerfed lining isn't a little more flexable than solid alowing for freer vibrations of the top. Just wondering. |
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| Author: | Alan Carruth [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 11:33 am ] |
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Thanks rlabbe. I think the word is 'tentellones', but you're right. OTOH, the old Esteso I worked on had the solid liners on top, and the kerfing (or tentellones, I can't remember at this point) on the back. Go figure. Usually there's a bit more purfling on the top, so you generally need a little bit wider liner there. Most guitar makers don't use Mario's boatbuilders technique for bending. Besides, it's pretty easy to cut off a lot of little blocks from a piece of wood about 1/4"x1/2" and split them along the diagonal for tentellones. Saves wood, too. I've long felt that the traditional methods make alot of sense if you remember that wood was expensive and labor was cheap. |
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| Author: | Ken Franklin [ Wed Nov 30, 2005 6:31 pm ] |
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I used solid linings of poplar on my latest steel string. They were 1/4 inch but bent more easily in my bender than I thought they would. |
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| Author: | Michael McBroom [ Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:41 am ] |
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I build classicals and for me it is easier to install tentellones along the top and linings along the back. Here's a photo of a guitar I'm working on at the moment: 
I use basswood for the linings, but I split it before bending and then laminated it afterward. I've found that basswood has a tendency to wrinkle at the waist bend if it's over 0.200" thick or so, but cutting the basswood into 0.100" strips for bending eliminates this problem. Best, Michael |
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| Author: | EBarajas [ Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:49 am ] |
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I personally like using reversed kerfed lining I think they're the best of both worlds. Thats all I use in my classicals. |
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